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Talk:Pyrithian Gorge

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the Pyrithian Gorge can't be on Talax. Neelix says, that the Talaxian defense forces were preparing for an invasion, but this invasion never happened, because Talax capitulated after the attack on Rinax, so there has never been any fights on Talax.--Bravomike 21:42, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Even before the invasion, there were some fights on Talax, as Neelix mentions in the episode:
NEELIX: Why once, during the battle of the Pyrithian Gorge I faced down an entire battery of Haarkonian artillery. There I was, with only a small crevice for cover.
and a short while later:
NEELIX: No, you don't know! Not everything. You don't know where I was the night Rinax was destroyed.
KES: On Talax, fighting with the defence forces.
NEELIX: I was on Talax, but I wasn't fighting with the defence forces. I was hiding from them. I wasn't a hero at the battle of the Pyrithian Gorge. I've never even been there.
Neelix claiming that he was on Talax but not fighting with the defense force makes clear that there were some fights on the planet, one of them being the Battle of the Pyrithian Gorge on Talax. --Jörg 22:00, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

actually it only says that Neelix was not fighting. OK, he doesn't say "I was on Talax, but I wasn't fighting with the defence forces cause nobody was fighting on Talax in this time", but he also doesn't say that there were fights on the planet. I don't have the script ready to cite, but he said something like the defense forces were preparing to fight off an invasion, not something like they were starting to fight off it.
Maybe there have been fghts on Talax before, the war lasted nearly a decade and we can't know whether Talax had been invaded once before and reconquered later, but there is in fact no line in the episode that clearly states that the gorge is on Talax, but several ones that make us (or at least me) think that it is on another planet--Bravomike 22:12, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

The line is:
NEELIX: I had the good fortune to be on Talax at the time with our defence forces, preparing for an invasion that never came. It wasn't necessary. The day after the cascade was deployed Talax surrendered unconditionally to the Haakonian Order.
There were numerous fights on Talax between Talaxians and Haakonians, amongst those fights was the one at the Pyrithian Gorge. Shortly after that, the Haakonians finally launched their final invasion of the planet, part of that was the metreon cascade which ultimately made the Talaxians surrender.
I think Neelix lines leave no doubt that that fight took place on Talax. His lie always was: fighting with them during the battle on the planet (and preparing for the invasion with his comrades at war) but the truth is that he WAS on Talax but not fighting alongside them, at the Pyrithian gorge, but hiding someplace else on Talax. --Jörg 22:25, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Again, I can't find any line in the whole episode that clearly states that the gorge is on Talax. I'll remove the {{pna-inaccurate}}, but I'm still convinced that the Pyrithian Gorge is not on Talax. (By the way, I think the line "preparing for an invasion that never came" is a positive proof , but I may understand the meaning of "never" in another way) --Bravomike 07:37, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I think your mistake is in thinking in an all or nothing fashion... look at World War II in Europe, for example. Before the Normandy invasion, there was still plenty of fighting going throughout Europe. Just because there was no invasion doesn't mean there wasn't a war going on, with battles potentially in multiple places on multiple fronts. -- Renegade54 14:05, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I understand what you mean (btw, I'm studying military history, I know that not every small, limited fight is a full sized invasion operation), but what I mean is:

  1. In the whole episode is no single line that says "The Pyrithian Gorge is on Talax".
  2. In the whole episode there are no two (or more) lines gives this in another way, like e.g. a first line "The gorge is near the city of ABC" in the beginning of the episode and a second line in the end of the episode that says "The battle of ABC was a big battle on Talax".

So in the end, the gorge may be on the planet. The battle may have been part of a Haakonian operation preparing the invasion, or there may have been fights on Talax long before that, but there is no proof in the episode that the gorge is on Talax. And that means: no proof = non-canon, especally when talking about a battle in a war that lasted nearly a decade (and that is the reason why I've removed the template, not because I haven't understood you but because I think my oppinion may be too strikly bound to word-for-word canon.)--Bravomike 17:48, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

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