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Talk:President of the United Federation of Planets

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Efrosian PresidentEdit

In this article, I would like to see the Efrosian President featured prominently with his glasses making the speech at the Khitomer Conference.

The second Borg Invasion was during Jaresh-inyo presdency wasnt it

This was posted by 68.221.244.58, but I moved it from the article here. -AJHalliwell 03:19, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

"Articles of the Federation" is not canon. Edit

I don't know about other people, but I would prefer that *all* information regarding the "Articles of the Federation" novel be confined to the Apocrypha section. As I've reverted/moved this several times, I'd like to know the communities opinion of this. - AJHalliwell 00:57, 21 Jul 2005 (UTC)

I agree, of course. Our policy hasn't changed, anything not from a "valid source" should be confined to such a section, a small background comment, or the article about the novel. Actually, I prefer the latter to a huge "Apocrypha" section - perhaps we can reduce that section to a background comment that mentions the novel and links to it? -- Cid Highwind 15:06, 21 Jul 2005 (UTC)
I might agree, except that so much of what was already accepted about the Presidents was also non-canonical. The name of the species that the President of 2293 belonged to, for instance, "Efrosian," is utterly noncanonical, yet that didn't stop its inclusion; similarly, the name of the species that Jaresh-Inyo belonged to, "Grazerite," was noncanonical, as was the name of his home planet, "Grazer," yet that didn't stop its inclusion. Because of that, I see no reason not to include noncanonical information on the page so long as that information is clearly defined within the article as being noncanonical. -- Sci 18:01, 7 September 2005 (EST)

Both of those examples actually came from their respective scripts, which MA actually does consider canon. - AJHalliwell 22:03, 7 Sep 2005 (UTC)

That strikes me as being a rather arbitrary standard, since the canon is defined by Paramount as that which appears onscreen. - Sci 01:03, 8 September 2005 (EST)

Full titleEdit

Question. In Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, the Federation President explicitly states his full title, "President of the United Federation of Planets." There's some disagreement here as to whether or not that full title should be included in this article; what say ye? Sci 01:05, 8 September 2005 (EST)

That's a good question. The titles Federation President and President of the United Federation of Planets is the same thing and it's kinda obvious that would be his full title, so I'm not sure if it's really necessary to reference the President stating his full title. We can't move this to the longer title, since the characters were credited as Federation President. We could create a redirect for President of the United Federation of Planets, but I don't think that would really be necessary. After all, if anyone is going to look for this page, I doubt they would sit there and type out President of the United Federation of Planets; they would probably just type President or Federation President. But as for mentioning the president referring to himself by his full title... I suppose you could add it in somewhere, but I personally don't think it's necessary. --From Andoria with Love 05:12, 8 Sep 2005 (UTC)

The claim that all the Presidents have been credited as "Federation President" isn't exactly true. The one seen in Star Trek IV is actually credited as "Council President," in spite of the contradiction between this and his full title stated onscreen. The one from Star Trek VI is credited as "Federation President," while I don't believe that the actor playing Jaresh-Inyo recieved a credit listing his character's name or title. - Sci 05:18, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

Actually, I think he was credited (Herschel Sparber as Jaresh-Inyo), but I could be wrong. In any case, I stand corrected on that point, but I still don't believe changing the bold text or the article title (although the latter was never really a topic of discussion) is unnecessary and a mistake. But now that I think about it, a note on the various names (Council President and President of the United Federation of Planets) might be needed. --From Andoria with Love 05:27, 8 Sep 2005 (UTC)

I refrained from changing the bold text, but added a note afterwords indicating that the President's formal title is "President of the United Federation of Planets." I saw no reason to include a note about "Concil President," since that title has never been confirmed onscreen or even in a noncanonical source such as a novel. -- Sci 05:34, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

My "two cents": My conceit would be that the full and "official" name of a given something should always be given, if possible. If the name in this case is "President of the United Federation of Planets," then "Federation President" should redirect to it, not the vice versa. For the political position of "Chancellor of the Klingon High Council" (Spock's wording), it should redirect to "Chancellor of the High Council (Klingon)," given the number of times other characters, specifically the Klingons themselves, have called it that, without the Klingon name attached. In turn, material presented in credits should always give way to material presented 'in the picture,' as in the case of the "Council President" credit. When it claims him one thing, but the program itself states him to be another, the credit is simply in error. --ChrisK 11:52, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

Talk:President of the FederationEdit

This page exists as Federation President, but wouldn't it make more sense at this location? E.g. "President of the United States," "Prime Minister of Australia," etc. Weyoun 20:53, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Actually, it would have to be President of the United Federation of Planets. --From Andoria with Love 21:46, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Jonathan Archer did become Federation President Edit

Jonathan Archer did become Federation President after his retirement from Starfleet. It was in the dialog, not just on the viewscreen. ENT: "In a Mirror, Darkly, Part II" -unsigned

Actually, it was only on the viewscreen. --From Andoria with Love 21:51, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

RemovedEdit

Removed the following:

  • as he is not elected through popular vote, but by the members of the Federation Council from among their own members. If this is true, then the Federation would be a parliamentary system.

as there is no canon evidence whatsoever of the method of selecting or voting for the President. --31dot 00:31, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

"Whatsoever" is a big word. I believe the idea came from the following:
  • Jaresh-Inyo: "I never sought this job. I was content to simply represent my people on the Federation Council. When they asked me to submit my name for election I almost said no. Today, I wish I had." (DS9: "Paradise Lost")
This probably needs to somehow be reintegrated to more accurately replace what was removed. --Alan del Beccio 00:42, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree that this could be reintegrated to restore the speculation, but the quote still does not definitively suggest how the President is elected. It could just as easily be a popular vote. --31dot 14:50, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

Human and Efrosian presidentsEdit

This article is about a title. The Efrosian and Human president listed here should be moved to their respective "unnamed species" articles, Unnamed Humans (23rd century) and Efrosians, or at least limit it so that the rest of the information about the character (actor, bg info) can be found elsewhere. Otherwise we should remove the other "named" president listed here and leave just the two unnamed presidents. One way or the other, as a Category:Titles article it shouldn't be meshed with content that essentially falls under the Category:Unnamed individuals, or rather one of it's sub-categories. --Alan del Beccio 01:43, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Possible Inaccuracy Edit

The article lists one of the president's jobs as budget preparation. Budget? As in estimates income and expenditure? I thought the Federation did not use money internally?– Watching... listening... 23:43, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Budgeting can just as easily refer to general resource allocation, without regards to money. For instance, if there are 1,000 industrial replicators in the Federation, and the UFP can only produce 786.89 per year at peak capacity, and there are 900 allied foreign governments (maybe all confined to a single solar system) applying for aide in the form of 2 industrial replicators each (which we know from "For the Cause" that the Federation sometimes provides) -- obviously, this is a budgetary issue, even if it's not one that involves Federation credits, and, since it involves foreign policy, which we know from Star Trek VI and "Homefront"/"Paradise Lost" that the Federation President supervises, obviously this is an issue that the President would be at least partially responsible for. I would also point out that the canon contains many references to the use of Federation credits and of commercial exchanges within the Federation even as it also contains references to the discontinued use of money -- the canon contradicts itself on this issue. But either way, it's logically accurate to say that the Federation President oversees budgetary considerations -- indeed, we see him doing just that in the Khitomer speech in Star Trek VI. -- Sci 12:25 11 FEB 2008 UTC

Removing note: speculative Edit

"Given the vast size of the Federation, it is possible the President is elected in a parliamentary fashion by sitting members of the Federation Council. It is equally possible that the Federation has a type of "electoral college system" where each member world is allocated a set number of votes depending on its population and importance. It is also just as possible that a simple popular vote is used, especially with the technology of the 23rd and 24th centuries which may allow for extremely efficient ballot systems."

Speculation - with this many unsupported possibilities, this isn't even helpful. I guess I'll add back in the first part, that:

"The method of electing the President of the United Federation of Planets is completely unknown and has never been discussed in a canon Star Trek production."

...because at least it's factual and potentially informative. --TribbleFurSuit 16:11, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

I agree it speculation which is why absolutely it should be kept out of the article proper. But as an actual background note, discussing the types of possibilities, is there some whay this can kept in? Maybe even in its own section or the apoc section. There are several articles that have notes like this. But all those other might be breaking the rules, who knows. Its just good material I feel that we should incorporate in somehow. -FC 16:52, 5 November 2008 (UTC)
Never mind the above. I have a much better idea as to how to reword this totally within the rules. Will get around to that when I have time. Best. -FC 21:19, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

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