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Talk:First Battle of Chin'toka

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FA status Edit

Nomination (13 May - 24 May 2004, Success) Edit

First Battle of Chin'toka

{{msg:DWB}}

Might as well nominate all articles linked to in this msg. -- Redge 15:52, 13 May 2004 (CEST)

Archiving: Originally tagged as "Featured" by User:MinutiaeMan at 11:02, May 16, 2004. --Alan del Beccio 21:47, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Reconfirmation (07 Apr - 01 May, Success) Edit

A FA from back in 2004. I haven't had the time to take a look at it yet. - Archduk3 18:02, April 7, 2012 (UTC)

  • Support, though I don't recall where resistance from Cardie and Dominion soldiers in the ground assault was mentioned. 31dot 10:09, April 10, 2012 (UTC)
  • Support. I removed the resistance sentence, since I wasn't able to find any mention of it in "Tears of the Prophets" or "The Siege of AR-558". - Archduk3 16:57, April 10, 2012 (UTC)
  • Support. My only concern is again the huge portion of free space following the prelude. Is there any way to fix this? Tom 19:16, April 11, 2012 (UTC)

I'm not seeing this free space, assuming I understand what you're talking about. Could it be a browser or skin based issue? - Archduk3 19:28, April 11, 2012 (UTC)

I am talking about the portion between "Prelude" and "The Battle" caused by the sidebar. It is possible that this is skin based. The same for me as mentioned above in Battle of Cardassia. Tom 19:34, April 11, 2012 (UTC)

That's your skin, in the standard oasis skin there isn't any problem. You could remove the {{clear}} template at the end of that section if you want, that should solve the issue. - Archduk3 10:02, April 17, 2012 (UTC)

Ships involved Edit

Any chance we can add known ships involved in this battle to the article somehow. I'm not sure it warrants a page like List of starships at Wolf 359, but some mention should be specifically made to the ships known to have participated. --Gvsualan 04:20, 8 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Do you mean actual ship names, or classes? I believe the Akira first made its appearance here...? 142.151.186.203 16:34, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

In retrospect, I'm really not sure what I meant exactly. --Alan del Beccio 21:47, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Romulan losses? Edit

I didn't see any Romulan warbirds destroyed on-screen. I was watching the syndicated version of the episode, though, so there may be some deleted scenes where one or more Romulan ships are lost. However, if it turns out that there were no (or extremely light compared to the Federation and Klingon) losses, that may be a relevant note to place in the article. The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.33.88.35 (talk).

I think I saw two D'deridex-class warbirds go down.--The All-knowing Sith'ari 22:07, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

What about this for the page?Edit

Akira orbital weapon platform
Part of: Dominion War
Location: Chin'toka system
Combatants: Federation Alliance:
United Federation of Planets
Klingon Empire
Romulan Star Empire

Dominion:

Cardassian Union
Strength: Federation Alliance:

Starfleet

Galaxy-class starships
USS Galaxy
USS Venture
Akira-class starships
Excelsior-class starships
USS Valley Forge
Miranda-class starships
Defiant-class starships
USS Defiant

Klingon Defense Force

Klingon Birds-of-Prey
IKS Rotarran
Vor'cha-class battleships

Romulan Fleet

D'deridex-class warbirds

Dominion

Orbital weapon platform
Jem'Hadar attack ships
Casualties: Federation Alliance:
Excelsior-class starships
USS Valley Forge
Miranda-class starships
Akira-class starships
Klingon Birds-of-Prey
Vor'cha-class battleships
D'deridex-class warbirds

Dominion

Orbital weapon platforms
Jem'Hadar attack ships

Well?--The All-knowing Sith'ari 22:07, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

No offense, especially since I'm sure it took a bit of time compiling the info and putting it together, but this sidebar/infobox really does not help the page at all... at the moment, it looks awful, particularly with all the images pushed down to the bottom and a huge empty space between the text and the template. Can we please remove it? --From Andoria with Love 04:18, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Ah, I did the same for Operation Return. Any way to fix that huge empty space?--The All-knowing Sith'ari 13:48, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

The long infobox just didn't look right on these pages at all. An infobox is supposed to contain brief supplementary info of the main points of the article, not every single ship that fought in every single battle and what-not. They're supposed to supplement the article, not cram the article's contents to the left while at the same time hiding other parts of the article (namely, templates). --From Andoria with Love 22:09, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Now that the infoboxes are shorter, I don't suppose...--The All-knowing Sith'ari 12:41, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Since I'm not getting any replies I'll put it back anyway...--The All-knowing Sith'ari 15:40, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

The infobox is still going to crunch the other images on the page. I still maintain it's no necessary. In addition, to reiterate, "An infobox is supposed to contain brief supplementary info of the main points of the article, not every single ship that fought in every single battle and what-not." Perhaps there is another way you can go about this besides a sidebar? Like maybe a table or grid near the bottom of the page? --From Andoria with Love 08:14, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Just tell me how an it will be so.--The All-knowing Sith'ari 19:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Dominion Strategic Victory? Edit

Just wondering, how exactly does this battle count as a Dominion strategic victory? The Allies captured a world deep within Cardassian space. Although, does the fact that nothing became of the grand offensive make it count as partially a Dominion victory?- JustPhil 16:18, June 9, 2010 (UTC)

I was unsure about this as well. When I first read that, I assumed that the writer was incorporating Dukat's simultaneous gambit with the Pah-wraith attack on the Prophets as part of the battle — not that I'd agree with that interpretation, but I could imagine someone making a case for it. It is true that the allies' inability to press their advantage further in the aftermath of Chin'toka is probably related to the fact that they temporarily lost one of their key strategic thinkers immediately afterwards (i.e. Sisko's leave of absence due to the death of Jadzia and the removal of the Prophets). Nevertheless I don't see how this battle was a strategic victory for the Dominion. —Josiah Rowe 06:55, October 5, 2010 (UTC)
In military terms, a "tactic" is employed in each individual battle, while a "strategy" concerns itself with a whole campaign or even war, consisting of many battles. It can be a good strategy to employ a bad tactic, for example by deliberately losing an individual battle if it leads the enemy forces into a trap and stalls them. This seems to be what is described here.
That said, I'm not sure how much of what is stated on the page really is purely descriptive, and how much of it is invalid interpretation. -- Cid Highwind 10:01, October 5, 2010 (UTC)
I think switching the text to something as little more straight forward would be best. This maybe: Federation Alliance victory resulting in tentative hold of the Chin'toka system. That removes the whole tactical and strategic parts, while still pointing out that the result left something to be desired. - Archduk3 10:53, October 5, 2010 (UTC)

Romulan losses 2 Edit

After finishing a marathon viewing of all DS9, I went back and checked this episode, and as was suggested earlier, it indeed looks like no warbirds were destroyed (onscreen) during the battle. In fact, it looks like no Romulan ships were destroyed onscreen during all of DS9. Might be worth noting, at least for this battle.

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